Logitech Z-2300 2 Speakers

CORRECTIONS: In my review below, I speak of having multiple negative experiences with Logitech. While this is true, some of those I have now learned were with Labtec devices, which I confused with Logitech--most importantly for this review, I confused my old Labtec 3-piece system for being of the Logitech brand. Labtec is no longer making computer speaker systems, but they are still manufacturing headsets. One or both of the faulty headsets I describe may have been Labtecs, in fairness.

Okay, I'll throw a negative review of the Logitech Z-2300 into its sea of glowing reviews. I waited... hm... well, longer than I'll admit here for the Z-2300 to go on a good sale, spoiled by the missed $50 rebate a few years back. Finally, a Christmas bargain at a local store netted me a score.

Of all the glowing reviews I've seen, none have been with a direct A/B of another (known) system for comparison. This is important for reference, since so much of this is subjective.

Well, I hooked them up, plugged my mp3 player directly in, put on a favorite Trance song, AND... was disappointed. Where is the detail? Okay, yes, it seems illogical to mate 3-inch speakers to a quite massive "sub"woofer (it's really "the" woofer), but once heard in person, that illogic was verified.

I'm not going to talk about frequency response, because there is back-and-forth as to whether mids are "missing" or very well present, and I even saw tomshardware do a frequency response test where the response seemed flat enough, but that wasn't in a controlled room, so it's not worth much--plus, I would hold with some skepticism reviews made by technical, not musical, people.

What I'll talk about is the detail--there really isn't any. MIA from my response are words like "clarity" and "pristine" I've seen bounced around in other reviews.

After just a minute or two of listening, I decided to stay on the same song, and spin around to my bookshelf system to see if I'm just crazy. On my bookshelf system, it seemed as if several layers of cloth had been removed from the audio, and I could hear "the music"--and the details--so much of a contrast, that I could actually hear the subtle digital noise of my low-bitrate but well-encoded MP3's. I plugged the MP3 player back into the Z-2300, still on the same song (rewinded to hear the same passage), and any hopes of hearing the digital wash of my MP3 was very gone, as were most of the other details.

I think I'm comparing apples to apples, as my bookshelf speakers, Design Acoustics PS-6 (6-inch woofer, 1-inch dome tweeter), are from the 80s, and despite being a "luxury" bookshelf speakers, can only be had on the used market, and probably cheaper than a new Z-2300. (However, you'd need a receiver [which you or your dad probably already has lying around], and possibly refoaming of the woofer surrounds--either of which [used receiver, or refoaming], would get the price up to or over the Z-2300, but still close enough to count.) While the PS-6 is naturally a bit light on bass, a roll of the bass knob on my receiver takes care of most of that problem. The Z-2300's biggest surprise was how much it made me appreciate my bookshelf speakers.

I'm also an owner and still current user of an older logitech 3-piece system (I forget the model now, but the woofer was non-ported & smaller, with metal grilles on the satellites). Though I thought the sound on that older, smaller Logitech system was great, there were some major annoyances, which seem to be largely addressed in the Z-2300, however yet with still (in my opinion) inferior results.

My older Logitech system had a crossover point which was too high. I know everyone says that, but those little 3 or 4-inch satellites were taking too much of the mid-bass. The Z-2300 has a lower crossover point, to the end that playing with the bass control knob doesn't seem to mess much with the midrange, like voices. However, I can never get that knob set to anywhere where it actually sounds good. And the bass IS way too high by default. But it's not about being "overwhelming", because I can turn it down, it's just so muffled, or so unclear or muddled, that it doesn't sound good at any setting, but especially over the default middle detent. The sound is the opposite of tight. Loud? Sure. Tight, no. The bass somehow still sounds overwhelming even when the knob is turned down, I think because you have to turn it up to hear details, in order to get a false impression of clarity. With my older logitech 2.1, the sound was quite nice and tight at just about any level of its bass control knob.

While I knew going into it that Logitech probably wouldn't be "accurate", I thought it would be "fun" to listen to--and there can be both, I know and appreciate this. My old Logitech 2.1 was "fun" to listen to--even with my much fancier home setup. Continuing the American thought process that "bigger is better", I was REALLY expecting to be entertained with the Z-2300! 'Twas not to happen. The Z-2300 is not "fun" to listen to, and actually kind of annoying, I find. I don't like to have to feel I have to turn the volume up to be able to discern details.

Aside from the sound of the Z-2300, and the oversized woofer, the thing is great! {eyeroll} So now for some numerous good things about the Z-2300, none of which have anything to do with what really counts: the sound. The Z-2300 addresses the issue of my older, smaller Logitech 2.1 system in how the satellites hook into the woofer. With my previous system, it was via an insane PS/2 (keyboard/mouse) connector--which jutted straight out towards the wall, giving the plug leverage on the jack, with inevitable disastrous and maddening results. Because of that, only one of my satellites works today, and I almost swore I'd never buy Logitech again (and still may--more on that later). The Z-2300 continues the (otherwise good) tradition of using easily-available computer connectors, but uses more secure ones. The controller uses what appears to be a standard VGA monitor (D-Sub) connector, which is far more robust than PS/2 to begin with, and then has 2 screws on top of it, to keep it secure. And the satellites, instead of connecting directly to the controller (my smaller 2.1 had the controls and integrated into one of the satellites), hook into the woofer via RCA connectors. These are all good things. I've seen people complain that the wires are permanently connected to the backs of the satellites. Well, at least with the RCA connectors at the sub, you can get couplers and standard RCA cables to easily extend them. Much better than other satellite systems where the satellites go into the proprietary cable, not into individual standardized connectors at the sub.

The Z-2300's separate wired remote resolves other issues of the previous logitech, as well--on/off switch accessibility, and now the bass control knob is on the remote, not on the back of the woofer box! Also, the rather huge heat fins from the back protect the already more-robust proprietary connector from getting mashed into a wall. Those (sharpish) fins could (update: can and will) hurt your wall's exterior--be careful. I would also think that the wired remote could be extended as simply as using a VGA extension cable, though I haven't tested this. Feel free to comment if you have.

3-piece powered computer speaker systems are very versatile (I'm an avowed surround-sound hater). You can plug MP3 players and, with the right adapter, just about any line-level sound source into them. The Z-2300 even includes an adapter to hook it up to RCA outs (say, a tape or CD deck's audio output). In a pinch, you can even hook one up in your car with an inverter if it's too much of a beater to replace the broken stereo (but I don't know anyone who would do that! ;). Now, I gotta say the Z-2300 would be FUN in a car (with a powerful-enough inverter!), where details aren't the important (bass and volume are!). However, the sub is arguably too big to get away with it, and the silver face of the woofer would attract more attention than standard all-black. (Update: I've tried this now--more at the bottom.) But some of this 2.1's versatility is negated by how directional the satellites are.

I think Logitech possibly gave themselves a pass on the 'clarity' or 'detail' end of things because, with the woofer beneath your desk (as these are generally intended to be used), you're not going to be hearing much detail, no matter how tight the loudspeaker. Then again, the woofer box is so big, a lot of people are not keeping them under their desks, but beside them.

The satellites are clearly (from listening) unfortunately only designed to be used close-in, like near-field monitors, and the phase bullet dust cap seems to be evidence of it. There is definitely a difference when you have these things pointed right at you in the proper way, versus walking around the room enjoying your music. The satellite drivers are 3" or 4" paper cones with what appear to be rubber surrounds, with a removable cloth grille, and some kind of hole at the top, which could be a port, or just a faux tweeter.

I didn't just try the Z-2300 with techno music, but that's what I figured it would excel at the most. I also tried some classic rock (Neil Young) and 70s (Yes), also regularly A/B'ing it to my bookshelf system. The net effect was that I didn't want to continue listening to the Z-2300, which is a very bad sign. I will continue testing when I can go louder, but I think a true test of a system is how it performs at lower volumes. I'll probably end up returning it.


This system would be good for:
- Teenagers who equate "loud" to mean "good sound", and want to drive their parents crazy or create a disturbance
- People who just love massive amounts of bass volume, regardless of the quality
- You want to be able to throw parties with loud music, but don't have room for big speakers
- People with large amounts of ill-gotten, poorly-encoded MP3's (since you can't, or can hardly tell the difference from the originals on these! That's not a good thing, btw.)
- Budget home theater & gaming systems meant for 1 person on a listening chair/station, where bass is mainly for rumbling and explosive sounds, heh


So now, the question to myself is why these speakers have gotten such normally glowing reviews? I've had this theory for awhile that most people in their 30's and younger have hearing damage, and normally aren't aware of it, and this definitely includes women. I believe this is from headphone/"walkman" abuse, and to a lesser extent, concerts. Maybe people are simply used to crappy speakers. And/or they're not A/B'ing them with their good ones. Years ago, I remember taking my older Logitech 3-piece into night shift work to compare it to my colleague's comparable Creative or Altec-Lansing setup. To write good reviews, you need to be into experimentation and comparison.

I'm not a bass hater. I'm not a classical or Jazz listener. I listen to industrial, techno, reggae, acoustic, classic rock, and other popular music. I love bass. I just love clean, tight, accurate, wonderful bass. Boomy, muddly, overwhelming bass is not wonderful. I actually think my older, smaller Logitech system is much more listenable and enjoyable (although I haven't yet A/B'd those). I think the reason is the older Logitech system's woofer has a SEALED ENCLOSURE. I've always avoided ported woofers, but figured, readimg the reviews, that the technology may have improved substantially since the 90's. I guess not. The Z-2300 just moves a tremendous amount of air (hold your hand at the port), but if that doesn't result in excellent sound, what good it is?

As a sidenote: Klipsch needs to get off its duff and start producing systems with horn WOOFERS, not tweeters! Horn woofers are really great! And yet, like many others, I hate horn tweeters (and have plenty of experience with them at night clubs and live performances), which is why I avoided (and will continue to avoid) Klipsch. Frequency response isn't everything. The human body is much more sensitive than many current testing techniques--the way that two different types of "chemically identical" salt can taste different, or the way different speaker systems with a relatively "flat frequency response" sound dramatically different.

At this point, I really can't suggest an alternative to the Z-2300, if we are speaking strictly in terms of low-priced 2.1 powered computer speakers. But I do suggest, to those who really get off on good QUALITY bass, to get a good, well-respected 2.1 system with a sealed enclosure, not bass reflex. The tradeoff in efficiency is worth every gain in accuracy. And keep in mind a sealed enclosure doesn't guarantee accuracy, either. It seems these are falling out of favor, possibly because most people prefer "loud" over "quality", and will note a lack of loudness in reviews more often than they can hear low detail. Pay careful attention to connectors, and how they will wear over time. If buying online, try to find reviews which have photos of those connectors. And keep in mind that 2.1 computer speakers tend to take more abuse than standard bookshelf systems.

My experience with Logitech:
Every experience I've had with Logitech turned sour, either in the short-run or long run. My older Logitech 2.1 system's problems are briefly described above, but much longer. One satellite (the main one with the controls on it) doesn't produce sound at all, and at the slightest movement of the PS/2 connector in the back of the sub produces startling ear-pounding bassy crackling. I also had huge difficulty, and needed to get heavy-handed getting a $30 rebate fulfilled from Logitech, too. I'm personally certain that Logitech's 3rd-party rebate was trying to fraud people out of their money (took me 6 months of trying, saying they "lost" my rebate, and were not responsible per their terms--then miraculously "found" my rebate when I threatened to contact my state's attorney general). I bought a fancy Logitech laser mouse which, like many fancy mice, was great on hardware, but just awful on the drivers, rendering it basically useless for my intended purpose (it sits unused). I've had 2 Logitech computer headsets: one was great while it lasted for a couple weeks, and a replacement different model I bought was DOA. So this is 0 for 4 (5, actually, counting the rebate) for Logitech, and probably my last effort. To balance that, their utility-grade mice I've used through the years (whether Logitech-branded, or OEM'd for HP and Dell), have always been great.


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UPDATE: Car Experiment (yep)

Call me ghetto, but I knew if I didn't find a use for this in my car (with a dead stereo system, down to the surrounds and internal wiring, not worth replacing), I'd have to return it. I managed to fit the woofer in the passenger footwell of my car (had to put the seat all the way back), put the satellites tucked on either side of myself, hooked up my 150 watt inverter, and cranked it up. Disappointed again. I believe in sound systems where no EQ is necessary. Bass was equally, unnaturally overwhelming in the car--maybe worse due to the smaller interior volume. But I was reduced to fiddling with my MP3 player's EQ. I found I had 2 choices: either turn the Z-2300's bass knob ALL the way down, or keep the knob at 'default' and turn the bass on my MP3 player's EQ all the way down. I found the latter sounded better. With some playing around, I found an EQ setting which was fairly pleasing. Again, the directional-ness of the high freq's from the satellite showed their inconvenience, as I had to pay extra energy to "aim" them at me, which wasn't completely possible.

So just on intuition, I turned the woofer the other way (I had had it turned towards me). It's hilarious, but with the woofer turned at the door, the damned thing sounded BETTER! I tried to figure out why, and came to the conclusion that the bass is less overwhelming with the woofer turned away. And the sound is so un-detailed already, it doesn't hurt any (the bass port is pointed straight back at the seat). Thing is, it's so huge, that ain't no one gonna be sitting in that seat with it there. With my old 2.1 system, while rude, people could sit there. Trashy? Yes. Embarrassing? Uh, yep, sure. "Pimp my ride"-ish? Uh-huh. But it works/it's cheap. Will I keep it? I'm not sure yet. The popular, cheaper 2.1 systems seem to be mostly bass-reflex, so going smaller wouldn't necessarily be an upgrade. Got a suggestion for a great, cheap sealed-box 2.1 system?

Oh, and those fins WILL scratch your car's plastic. (Like it matters, if you'd try this). But maybe be more concerned for the fins than your wall, in case you return them. Also, there is an annoying blue LED on the wired remote (electrical tape time--more ghetto!).

FURTHER UPDATE: Went on a 3000-mile road trip where I did a lot of listening. Unfortunately, the speakers hurt my ears, and it's not volume per se. There's some quality of the tweeters that I find harsh, which you probably won't, but I do. I have to keep the volume low or turn the tweeters away from me a bit when I turn things up, often. However, it is quite entertaining to be able to really turn things up on bassy songs it does well with, however muddled and inexact the overall sound is. I would challenge listeners during their return period to listen to the song "Electricity" by OMD, if they're familiar with the song and have it, as that one was song it did worst with, sounding WAY different and worse than anything other system rendition I remember. Gone is the atmosphere of the cheesy synths & recording technology of the 80's, replaced by a way-exaggerated bass drum drowning out almost everything else.

For some songs it did well with, Depeche Mode's album "Playing The Angel" and a remix of "Personal Jesus" did pretty well, though their older albums fared poorly. Erasure stuff was mixed. Most entertaining, if not accurate, was "Breath of Life", track 4 on "Chorus". You can really get some mixed results with this system.

Another note is the remarkably low self-noise this system has. The built-in amplifiers on these powered systems tend to be a bit dirty, but not this one... which, in a way, makes it even more frustrating when the drivers are just not accurate. You can turn it all the way up with nothing playing (have it attached to a piece of gear, though), and hear very little noise. My Archos XS202s MP3 player is silent, so I can gauge it.

Ultimately, I kept it, not because I liked it so much, but because I don't know of a 3-piece system in this price range (or cheaper) which is superior (and preferably smaller and less directional). I'm sure there is, I just don't know which, and welcome input.

In unrelated news (Jan '08), it appears Microsoft is taking aim at a Logitech takeover. Logitech is a Swiss company, but of course makes it stuff in China.